New Casualty Removal Procedure?

[Messyshaw]

With only 0.7% of RTC victims receiving spinal injuries, theres a school of though that abandoning lenghty precautionary cutting out/roof off strategies should be abandoned over casualties simply walking out, as more lives will be saved

Its an interesting concept (as long as you are not one of the 0.7%)🤔

Doctors to Overhaul Rescue Techniques

Edited July 6, 2022 by Carl
Link formatted correctly

[Keith]

To a certain extent, this is already happening, with paramedics doing a few initial checks and questioning the casualty, they'll give the thumbs up or not for them to walk out.

It could be linked to the fact that survival cells within modern vehicles are much stronger than before. I'm sure we've all noticed that even in heavy impacts the crumple zones and SRS are doing their job and the survival cell is relatively intact and the entrapments and injuries appear less severe than before. Flip side of this though, is if you've come to a sudden stop from a high speed impact the energy has to go someone, so the internal injuries are more severe. As these are harder to detect, it does make sense to get those injured into a primary care setting to be assessed and dealt with quicker.

We were actually talking about this after a recent RTC and it reminded me of a crash test Fifth Gear done a few years ago using a Smart Car. Whilst it held up well in the crash, ultimately the internal injuries would have been un-survivable.

Fifth Gear Crash Test

[Mitch]

Seems to be happening here. Cannot remember the last time I removed a roof. Been to a few that would have been in the past but the ambulance crews (air ambo) walked them out. 

[Jan Pawlowsk]

I've never seen anyone to be cutting the roof of a crushed car. Seems like with time, new methods are found to be more efficient.

[MAdams]

On 06/07/2022 at 11:33, Keith said:

To a certain extent, this is already happening, with paramedics doing a few initial checks and questioning the casualty, they'll give the thumbs up or not for them to walk out.

It could be linked to the fact that survival cells within modern vehicles are much stronger than before. I'm sure we've all noticed that even in heavy impacts the crumple zones and SRS are doing their job and the survival cell is relatively intact and the entrapments and injuries appear less severe than before. Flip side of this though, is if you've come to a sudden stop from a high speed impact the energy has to go someone, so the internal injuries are more severe. As these are harder to detect, it does make sense to get those injured into a primary care setting to be assessed and dealt with quicker.

We were actually talking about this after a recent RTC and it reminded me of a crash test Fifth Gear done a few years ago using a Smart Car. Whilst it held up well in the crash, ultimately the internal injuries would have been un-survivable.

Fifth Gear Crash Test

Professor Tim Nutbeam heads up a lot of the new recent regarding the change in procedures regarding RTC's for that exact reason, more people die because of the internal injuries they have sustained apposed to being paralysed from either the crash & subsequent mechanism of injury or from our handling of the casualty. The recent research shows that casualties are better off being able to removed themselves from the car or with assistance from the FRS instead of having the roof off and being strapped and boarded. 

[Percy]

It’s horses for courses - there’s always going to be a need to cut the roof off, getting the medics full access being one of the reasons and if the casualty is that bad they need that they are ‘not walking out’ any time soon.

It might only be 0.7% have spinal injuries, but a lot more have fractures, some major and/or life threatening and is like to see people self rescue with those

I admit though, I’ve seen the other end of the spectrum to this ‘get them to try and walk out’ methodically, and cutting the roof off when they clearly had nothing wrong with them and an easily repairable car too, but the past is just that.

On 18/07/2022 at 14:38, Jan Pawlowsk said:

I've never seen anyone to be cutting the roof of a crushed car. Seems like with time, new methods are found to be more efficient.

Do you mean you’ve never seen anyone require cutting the roof of a car?

[Crog]

48 minutes ago, Percy said:

It might only be 0.7% have spinal injuries, but a lot more have fractures, some major and/or life threatening and is like to see people self rescue with those

I’ve been on a 2 car RTC, roof off one car for poss spinal injuries. Second car driver was already out and passenger had got out, wandered round and got into the back of the car. We offered options to paramedics for him, but they ended up walking him out. As soon as he was on a trolley, lots of medics surrounded and started working furiously, completely at odds with him having walked out. Turned out he was so drunk and high on illegally gained drugs, couldn’t feel any pain. Due to this and how he presented he the car, medics had missed his 2 broken femurs and tib/fib break on one leg and rushed him off in critical condition.

[Messyshaw]

@Crog. He walked out with both femurs fractured?  - wow!!! 😳😳

[Crog]

Yep. We watched him take a leisurely stroll to the bed and then wandered why the medics seemed to be in mass panic all of a sudden. He obviously had a good dealer.