Driving

[CaptainFlack]

Evening all.

Just wondering what other brigades do regarding driving and extra payments?

Does said driver get paid an extra £10 every time they're in the seat? Do they get more if the vehicle is larger - aerial or HVP etc?

Or do they receive no extra payment for the unique skill that is driving an appliance round on blues?

Always a hot topic round the mess table with the old sweats.

Do you think you should get paid for it? After all it's your license on the line. 

I'll kick it off - in GMFRS drivers receive no additional payments up here.

[Aspire]

Nothing extra in London, used to £8 each time assigned as driver for the older troops, but that got taken away around 2011/2012 as part of a range of local negotiations. 
 

56 minutes ago, CaptainFlack said:

Or do they receive no extra payment for the unique skill that is driving an appliance round on blues?

I get the sentiment, but not sure i’d call it unique, the other services have large vehicles that drive around on blues. Here, Transport for London’s Emergency Response Unit is the same size as a Fire Engine and is driven on blues by a BTP driver.

58 minutes ago, CaptainFlack said:

Do you think you should get paid for it? After all it's your license on the line. 

Loads of driving jobs, your licence is on the line. How often do we spend on the blues in comparison to how long we’re on duty, considering the utilisation rate of total time is around 7/8%…

Just playing Devils Advocate here, but we are trained to a higher level, accidents happen but the fact we are on blues shouldn’t necessarily increase that chance. 

[Noddy]

No extra payment in West Mids and in my opinion nor should there be.  I agree with Aspire in that it’s hardly a unique skill?  

If you take one shout in isolation, say a house fire, then en route the driver is driving yes.  But the second the handbrake is applied, their job is done (driving) and it’s now the turn of the rest of the crew to do theirs.  BA wearers could then argue their job is unique as they go through the front door.  

[Healdav]

I was told way back in 1963/4! that at one time there were payments for every skill learned, then they were stopped (nationwide - not the TV programme - because it got ridiculous, and there was a general pay rise to take over, and since then everyone got the same.

Having seen the tangle of bonus payments they get in some industries, I think the Fire Service is well out of it. Just imagine strikes (as there were in industry) because a fireman paid a bonus to drive touched a hose that was the domain of a bonus paid different fireman. In industry they called it restrictive practices and you had strikes over whether a carpenter could cut the lead in a pencil or did it need a plumber.

 

[WTTJ]

No extra payments for us. However it's not compulsory either, which I think it should be. Too many watches are relying on the same drivers every shift.

[OscarTango]

Is there anywhere that does actually give extra payment? I didn't think anywhere does, I thought it was just an old school gripe like shift allowances and such like.

Drivers occupy a funny position. Its not compulsory, but you're license is on the line, its high responsibility and its not just the driving. You're the OiCs right hand man (person). You could be command support, entry control, pump operator and possibly first aider all at once. It can be the easiest job on the fireground or the hardest. It is a funny place to be sometimes.

But you cant really quantify "chance of having to juggle multiple things at once". Not in a way that you use to say "we do X extra work and so should receive Y extra payment". Especially in the context of other services who drive on blues more of the time.

Personally I dont think it warrants extra payment. If it was compulsory for everyone to drive then that's a different argument. But I volunteered to do driving as it seemed like a challenge and would increase by understanding of how to be at least half decent at my job (which it has).

[Luminoki]

The only role that ive ever known that attracted an “Added Risk Allowance” in West Mids was when the boat and line rescue were on normal stations ( well before my time ) these were eventually given over to Technical Rescue so the allowance disappeared

[CaptainFlack]

Running along side any driving question is the usual 'Should be compulsory to drive when you start your course' or 'In my day you had to have your licence or you didn't get taken on' 

The old NVQ has gone with FF9 so it isn't part of the probation anymore.

Some people have no intention of ever driving appliances, some don't have regular car licences. Which will result in a dearth of drivers and as the pot diminishes over time, what do you do entice people to drive? 

I think West Yorkshire still pay, anyone on the wrong side of the pennines verify it?

[Toffer]

You have to have a licence now when joining GMFRS. Doesn't really help the driver situation, because you will have people that still don't want to do it. I would like to drive in the future as I see it as another way to further my learning and becoming a more rounded FF, but that's just my view. Don't think forcing people to drive is the right answer but then I don't know what is. 

[Percy]

On 13/05/2022 at 14:50, CaptainFlack said:

The old NVQ has gone with FF9 so it isn't part of the probation anymore.

Don't confuse the NVQ 3 qualification requirements with requirements of Role Maps. The NVQ may have gone, but the Role Maps are still very much in effect.