Carl Posted September 20, 2017 Share Posted September 20, 2017 Good Luck @Dyson. I got through our sift last month and decided to pull out of it. Too many hoops for me, to do something I personally wouldn't enjoy given our current climate. People say I was stupid too, others have said in equal measure they understand why. Never say never, but this time wasn't for me, especially with the changes we are going through at the moment. 1 Link to comment
Dyson Posted September 20, 2017 Author Share Posted September 20, 2017 Yeah understand that Carl, they approached me again with an ops opportunity and I decided it's time to step up....to give it a go. I'm pretty pumped about having more people to lead and influence positively and running bigger jobs. How does leave work? Do I get more ? If I want a 24 off, how does that work ? What about a duty weekend ? Link to comment
Carl Posted September 20, 2017 Share Posted September 20, 2017 I think it will be different in every service. We have around 72 FDS Officers so I am guessing swapping around is an easy task, perhaps not so easy in your own FRS? Link to comment
Dyson Posted September 20, 2017 Author Share Posted September 20, 2017 ? What I can't just book leave ? ? Also how do I get off development pay? Link to comment
Ian Posted September 21, 2017 Share Posted September 21, 2017 Dyson, Certainly from Herts perspective, we can move around our 9's & 9.5's really easily.... in fact i change mine around daily to suit the rhythm of my life. It is without doubt on of the benefits of FDO role. 24's a little more tricky but as long as we have 6 officers on duty over night then they too can be moved without drama. We only cover a duty weekend in every 6, and again a blanket email to the officer group will always get a positive response. I may not get as much time at home unlike 2-2-4 but its quality time and I'm home every night and even a duty weekend I go about my business but with an Iphone strapped to me. I don't think I could go back to 2-2-4 again....too many weekends!!!!! Link to comment
Dyson Posted September 21, 2017 Author Share Posted September 21, 2017 Thanks Ian ? So you can start your non 24 days to suit, as long as you do the hours that day ? That's gonna be good. Are you available for calls those days or will they use the guys on 24 for all calls ? You still tell control where you are ? How much leave do you take for a 24 or duty weekend? Or do you just need to swap with someone ? My 24s and weekends will be slightly less fun than yours cos I need to camp out at a specific station. ?? Link to comment
Ian Posted September 21, 2017 Share Posted September 21, 2017 Thanks Ian ? So you can start your non 24 days to suit, as long as you do the hours that day ? Yes ....absolutely! That's gonna be good. Are you available for calls those days or will they use the guys on 24 for all calls ? Nearest officer goes regardless of duty You still tell control where you are ? Sometimes...but all FDO vehicles have AVLS so control know where we are How much leave do you take for a 24 Use a PH for 24's or duty weekend? Or do you just need to swap with someone ? Can only swap your duty weekend! My 24s and weekends will be slightly less fun than yours cos I need to camp out at a specific station. ?? I can empathise with you as I done the same in the LFB Link to comment
CaptainFlack Posted September 21, 2017 Share Posted September 21, 2017 As the prototype brother now has his third 50p on his rank markings and is out and about now - I wonder why most of you opt for promotion. Totally understand the need for senior officers in brigades and get that your own personal development is what drives you to do it but why would you ever want to stop riding a fire engine? I say it in the most simplest as terms because im sure when most of you were young, all you wanted to do was become a firefighter and tear arse round on blues putting fires out and rescue people. That's the glamour that many people see and indeed want to be part of. It will always have that image and inspire young men and women to join the job but I find it alien that you would want to come away from it. It virtually rubber stamps your days in the machines, on station as an integral part of the watch, over and all those realationships with colleagues and the unique camaraderie on station will fade in time - Im not saying that you suddenly switch off and not talk to former colleagues but I see it as a lonely career path, similar to the army bomb disposal guy doing the long walk type of thing. Works-police, One of 'them' rather than 'us', only meeting up at large incidents and other guys doing their best to try and prevent you from turning up in the first place! The 'Stopping the ADO' was a great thread to read. How many on here uttered the words "When I grow up I want to be an ADO and drive a car round" growing up?? Link to comment
Dyson Posted September 21, 2017 Author Share Posted September 21, 2017 Thanks again Ian. You've told be 100% more than anyone at work ? And captain flack - great questions. In my case, I haven't pursued it, it's kinda cone to me. I love watch life, my watch is the best in the brigade, probably the world ? But now I have an opportunity, a great one at that. It's only temp so if I don't like it, I go back to my watch. I will eventually in any case actually. The brigade needs leaders. The point has come that after being approached several times over the years I've begun to ask questions of my self. I need to step up and lead. The brigade needs it, the troops need it. If I'm not the right guy we will know soon ? As for stopping the ADO, yeah that's not gonna work guys ? 1 Link to comment
Noddy Posted September 21, 2017 Share Posted September 21, 2017 Captain I felt the same as you and although I haven't gone above WM, the novelty of riding a truck eventually wore off. The next challenge beckoned and I grabbed it... and I couldn't go back to riding the wagons again. I guess I'm lucky in that I am still operational, albeit fires only, but my buzz now comes from the increased responsibility Link to comment
Becile Posted September 22, 2017 Share Posted September 22, 2017 Captain /Dyson. My situation v similar to Ian in herts. Certainly station life has it's benefits and attractions and suits many, I came to realise that as a flexi/ADO whatever you want to call it. You got to keep some of the exictemnt of incident life /shouts admitedly not down and dirty stuff.But what I was able to do was have a greater part / say / influence in things both within my own service and UK FRS as a whole. For my service especially many of my skill sets have been developed at Flexi role. I am released from duty to attend national stuff (nilo, hazmat, airwave etc) and get involved and am trusted / given an element of freedom to develop areas of the service (body worn video as an example) The downside - the inevitable politics, computer work, emails, meetings. Yes it gets lonelier as you move up, as watch culture moves into a more Rota culture (7 on my Rota) and catching up at training / meetings rather than everyday / night shift. It works for me, wouldn't suit everyone, were all different. Link to comment
Steve Posted October 3, 2017 Share Posted October 3, 2017 On 21/09/2017 at 09:26, CaptainFlack said: As the prototype brother now has his third 50p on his rank markings and is out and about now - I wonder why most of you opt for promotion. Totally understand the need for senior officers in brigades and get that your own personal development is what drives you to do it but why would you ever want to stop riding a fire engine? I say it in the most simplest as terms because im sure when most of you were young, all you wanted to do was become a firefighter and tear arse round on blues putting fires out and rescue people. That's the glamour that many people see and indeed want to be part of. It will always have that image and inspire young men and women to join the job but I find it alien that you would want to come away from it. It virtually rubber stamps your days in the machines, on station as an integral part of the watch, over and all those realationships with colleagues and the unique camaraderie on station will fade in time - Im not saying that you suddenly switch off and not talk to former colleagues but I see it as a lonely career path, similar to the army bomb disposal guy doing the long walk type of thing. Works-police, One of 'them' rather than 'us', only meeting up at large incidents and other guys doing their best to try and prevent you from turning up in the first place! The 'Stopping the ADO' was a great thread to read. How many on here uttered the words "When I grow up I want to be an ADO and drive a car round" growing up?? I have to say, it was never a desire of mine, I suppose, like a lot of people, I wanted to be a Station Officer, but having got there in about 12 years, I didn’t think about it but probably couldn't keep it up for the next 20 years.... I have a very good watch at a busy station, but in reality, nothing stays the same so I guess that realisation dawned on me. I did a bit of T/ADO after 15 years and then went back to Stn O when the strikes were on in 2002/3. I was glad to be back, but suddenly felt very constrained and by late 2004 I had been acting up again and had bene made up to ADO. I can answer your questions easily as I have been on both sides. I'm going to be frank, so please, I don't want anyone to be offended. Ops, in a large Brigade you are much, much busier, it essentially filters the 20 or 30 or 50 or so nonsense calls you get in between proper jobs. Apart from an ADO being on the odd PDA, which turns into nothing, everything you go to is a proper job of some description. Time on duty also gives you more focus. For me, now, life on station would be claustrophobic and stifling. The reality is, the job isn't what it was in the 1980's and 90's, calls and fires are not what they were so it is a fact that station based crews are filling their day with not a lot of the 'image that inspires people' going on from day to day. I accept that in principle, there is a load of bullsh1t and politics.... but the difference is, in the Fire Service, which has always been a sad bastion of treating people like idiots, I own that bullsh1t and politics. I do it on my terms and kick back at the organisation where I think the time of my people is going to be wasted. But it is me that does this and not them. I accept not all officers are like this and plenty seem to be unable to use their influence. I'm afraid that is the difference between being a manager and a leader. The way I saw it was, I was given a chance and that chance required me morally to work both ways, I wasn't just a vehicle to pass orders down, I took the view you pay me a lot of money for my ability, so you'll get my opinion as well. As for friendships and banter? I've never been lonely, I engaged with all four watches as a Station Commander, ate with them and socialised with them at times. I've had plenty of trips, nights out, overnighters and the odd messy weekend in Benidorm. As a Borough Commander I get that 16 times over now instead of four. Again, this is personality driven, I am a people person and although Officers do hide away and become lonely, that is probably their personality and definitely their own choice. I know many, many people across LFB on all Watches and all departments. Purely down to 15+ years as an Officer. On top of that, I was fortunate enough to be of a vintage to remain on the original pension, I could, if I wanted never work again if I retire. At the end of the day, we work to live right? I wouldn't have been able to do that on a Ff's pension, no disrespect, just a fact. So having had 15 fantastic years on various watches as a Fm to Stn O and getting on for 16 years as a ADO/GM I can tell you the excitement, feeling of value, mind stretching challenges, high octane adrenalin as well as maintaining good relationships and being taken seriously at every level of the organisation, has certainly been in the latter half of my career. 4 2 Link to comment
Dyson Posted October 3, 2017 Author Share Posted October 3, 2017 Thanks for that Steve, i start next week, and thats exactly what i needed to hear . Catch ya on the biggen 2 Link to comment
Percy Posted March 9, 2018 Share Posted March 9, 2018 On 21/09/2017 at 09:26, CaptainFlack said: As the prototype brother now has his third 50p on his rank markings and is out and about now - I wonder why most of you opt for promotion. Totally understand the need for senior officers in brigades and get that your own personal development is what drives you to do it but why would you ever want to stop riding a fire engine? Only just logged on so apols for the belated reply. So as the afore mentioned brother... When I was a little boy visiting the old Leigh Fire Station I can still remember the class being introduced to the Station Officer. Having a keen eye for detail I noticed another officer in a white shirt but this one had three 50p's not two. So I asked what he did and the Station Officer said that's the ADO and he goes to shouts in a car... "Why would anyone want to do that?" I innocently replied as to a 6 year old any position past riding a Fire Engine was just silly... to be fair it still is for some of the time. Fast-forward a couple of decades and I managed to join the job I'd always wanted. First Training School and then out onto on to Station and for a while it was big grins... and then, for me yes quite probably because of 'the way I am' the monotony was killing me. I didn't think I was being challenged mentally and I dreaded the thought of Groundhog Day for the next (then) 30 years. So quite early on I studied for the Crew Commander ITOP (as was) and then the full ADC and passed with flying colours which saw me move to another station with interesting specials.. about 28 of them!, and we had interesting special appliances too. Only joking, as with the previous Station the people were great by and large but again once the honeymoon period was over the monotony appeared again 'same ole same ole'. So took the Watch Commanders and passed that and got a job on the same Station. Now I enjoyed this as I felt there was much much less monotony and It was down to me to ensure things didn't get stale and to keep people interested. But after a while I just fancied a new challenge and three years later I sat my Station Manager ADC the day before the first day of the strikes. (Tuesday 23rd September 2013) and passed that. I moved into Day Work and Resources which included designing future crewing system options and stations configuration options dependant on budget. Hardly testosterone fuelled shirt ripping off excitement either to be fair but I managed my own time and diary and it allowed lots of flexibility. Four years passed until we next gave out any jobs due to a drastic 50% reduction in the Flexi Duty Rota brought on by Austerity but by then some of us in the 'no mans land' had attended many courses of the AGC (Assistant Group Commander) Development and rather than throw us to the way side and start a new process a rare outbreak of common sense prevailed and those in the holding pool had to have a new process which selected 4 of the original 8 for the next Flexi posts and I was one of them. So now I am a Borough Commander which is very rarely Groundhog day and working to a shift system I helped design I like the responsibility of being where I am, I am helping to plan for our attendance at a 'horse race' which sees approx. 130,000 come included HM (although she doesn't camp out and cause fires with disposable BBQs, or get stuck on the Fairground needing releasing or has too many in the beer tent then has a punch up with the Travellers - well one hopes!) and ultimately I like being in a place to help people on my Stations to be their happiest they can be in an unprecedented time in the Fire Services history to do the job they are good at. I will see if I still feel the same in another two years or so. 1 1 Link to comment
Becile Posted March 9, 2018 Share Posted March 9, 2018 Better get that risk assessment done that I sent you then..before Queeny gets there to play with her her gee gees .lol 2 Link to comment
Dyson Posted March 9, 2018 Author Share Posted March 9, 2018 So Guys, its been 6 months or so now..... thought id update you on the journey ....I've hardly been on here since i started, i literally haven't had any time !! Im running several fire stations, and am responsible for a fairly large chunk of the county, The difference between what i did before and this job is huge, from levels of responsibility to time spent on duty, massive. In one 10 day period on my shift i work a 48, an 80 (DW) and another 48 hour shift....all on station, not from home. Im loving it, i love running the level 2 jobs (its busy where i am), and running jobs which are more stretching (for me) I love leading many more people, and having a positive influence on those people. I love the responsibility I'm given, although at times its hard, it really is. Its opened my eyes to parts of the Service i never knew (or cared) existed, its taught me a few lessons about myself, its taught me a few lessons about other people, After many years (14) as a riding Watch Commander, this has been perfect, it really has developed me, I've made mistakes, no doubt i'll make more, but i needed this. They pay me a bit more, i get a nice car, its all good. Im still temp, its been extended indefinitely, so we will see where i end up. I hear LFB want Station Commanders this year...? Thanks to you all for the advice given, it was very helpful Catch ya on the biggen 3 1 Link to comment
Ian Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 Dyson, I'm glad you are enjoying mate. 1 Link to comment
Carl Posted August 9, 2018 Share Posted August 9, 2018 On 17/04/2017 at 21:38, Carl said: Never say never, but it would have to be an interesting post to convince me. And here I am 16 months down the line after posting this, promoted to Station Manager. ? 1 4 1 Link to comment
Luminoki Posted August 10, 2018 Share Posted August 10, 2018 I presume the post offered was more interesting than before? Link to comment
Carl Posted August 10, 2018 Share Posted August 10, 2018 As you know things change frequently in the fire service and the options available last time, are different this time, so I am very happy to be given this post 1 Link to comment
Nawaf Kadhim Posted October 24, 2018 Share Posted October 24, 2018 Really good advice from everyone and it's very interesting to get am overview of how things are. Link to comment
BeElveBubb Posted January 10, 2019 Share Posted January 10, 2019 Never regretted it once. Got fed up with idiots taking over my jobs, if anyone was gonna lose it, it should be me! Didn't stop idiots turning up with a clipboard tucked under their arm, but if I was first, and due to location I frequently was. But then there was all the non-op hassles..... The decision is: do I want a car fire or AFA at 3am, or do I want to go to check a rave is safe or command a proper working job? Link to comment
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