Apprenticeships?

[Rory-495]

All I will say is revise everything you can. 

The morning is easy, bit of lifting from open water, ladder pitches and maybe a few knots.

The afternoon is the test which is overseen by skills for justice, no Babcock staff. Proper exam conditions.

The test is 60 questions multiple choice and I'd say that on average everyone guessed a good 20 of those questions, not great when the pass is 39!

You find out the result a few weeks later.

We have raised several concerns over the actual questions being asked but that's under investigation so I won't comment further on that.

Basically, REVISE!

But good luck!

[Charlie_]

Thanks for the heads up! Will start revising, just absolutely everything yeah? Plus CCA and JESIP? 
 

[Out In The Past]

Is the actual test wildly different from the mock questions Rory?

[Rory-495]

CCA JESIP and look into NOG BA procedures and policies. It's a national test and they haven't tailerord it for LFB so all the BA questions won't make sense.

Wouldn't say wildly different... But it's got so much more to it. A lot of managerial issues and how they would be deal with them. Sorry I can't be much more use as I'm struggling to remember a lot of the questions 

[Lumie]

Sat the test yesterday, it was by far much worse than the mock. I’ll be surprised if I’ve got 50%. I’m not a terrible test taker, getting mostly 95-100% in training school!

Out of 60 questions, I had to guess at least 40 of them. There were about 8 I knew hand on heart.

Heres some examples I can think of from yesterday:

”When a distress to wearer occurs, what equipment is impounded for investigation?”. Your options were along the lines of “BA set, cylinder, log book”, “BA set, log book, ECO board, tallies”, “ba set, cylinder, tallies, log book”.

”in a confined space, you shouldn’t disturb sludge or slurry because:”, “it can release toxic gas”, “it will cause a raise in fluid levels”, “it will cause an explosion”.

”you’re committed into a job with 200 pressure, your safety margin is 60 bar, what’s your turn around pressure” - we don’t commit under 240 and out safety margin is 45 bar. I put 160 but apparently that was wrong.

a couple questions about employers duties under Health and Safety at Work Act.

A couple questions about Equality Act.

“How many bar should you use during a monthly B test” - I don’t know pal, you taught us 15 minutes for a wear!

Few questions about tactical modes at jobs such as if one sector is offensive and one is defensive, what is the overal mode for the job: offensive, defensive, alternate, none. I’ve never heard of alternate mode in London so went with offensive because you have people in a risk area. Apparently alternate is used some places nationally so it might be?

Good luck, we might meet up soon when I have to come re sit it.

[Rory-495]

Lumie, make sure you contact your union rep to let them know the questions still haven't been adjusted to represent LFB policy.

[LFB92]

What happens when the brigade outsources everything. Joke

[Rory-495]

The issue is other FRS have been doing the apprenticeship program for years and it's well established and everyone is singing off the same hymne sheet. But LFB have picked up the same test without properly vetting it to make sure it fits with our policy

[Dangly1]

Lumie did you or anyone else taking the test raise the issue with whoever was taking the test at the time? Do you go to one of the Babcock venues to take it like one of the ffd training modules? 

I won't go through all the questions you mentioned, but with regard to the tactical mode answer if you have one sector in offensive another in defensive you would state on your informative all the usual stuff, then when you'd normally state just one tactical mode you say for example sector one offensive, sector three defensive no overall tactical mode. Not heard of alternate tactical mode maybe someone from another brigade has heard of this term?

[Lumie]

@Dangly1 the invigilator was quite strict about it we spoke during the test then we’d be kicked out. Once we came out of the test and saw our ‘apprenticeship coaches’ all hell broke lose haha. We were sitting there just reeling off all these questions and they were just sitting there trying to tell us it’s our fault. I’ve spoke to a friend in a county brigade and she said transitional mode is on policy in her brigade, but she’s never seen it used.

i have a list of questions compiled that we believe were unreasonable. If anyone sitting this test wants to see them then give me a message. Not sure if I’ll get given a stage 3 from Babcock for sharing the questions on a public forum😂🤷🏼‍♂️

[JonnyHolbs]

If you saw that document that accompanied the video from the new Commissioner: all major contracts to be reviewed by June 2020. Fingers crossed that s**tshow gets the boot.

[Lumie]

@JonnyHolbs I did mention that. We were hoping Babcock need the ‘figures’ of passes to keep the contract.

I think I may have pi**ed off a Babcock trainer by saying that, I got a nice little “if you’re crap, you won’t have a job” off them in front of my squad. 

[JonnyHolbs]

@Lumie stay classy, Babcock. You’ll be fine, I’m sure. They can’t sack all of you, especially those like yourself that actually care and are good.

1 hour ago, Lumie said:

“if you’re crap, you won’t have a job”

If only that was true, as well. There are some terrible FFs out there with no interest in being good at their jobs or being physically fit enough to be effective. They all still have jobs and they’re not going anywhere soon. 

[Magga110]

Ahhh yes the exam! 
I took my exam a few weeks ago,

My word it was mess....

Not a single person from my squad was confident they had passed and as you have mentioned most of the questions were a total guess. The apprenticeship coach told us to revise all of our previous learning materials. None of the questions would be found in our materials so pretty pointless!

Skills for justice wont let babcock near the exam so they don't have a clue.

I left the exam fuming and am expecting to go back for a re sit

[Magga110]

Although i have just found out I miraculously passed it! 

Edited March 9, 2020 by Carl
Quote removed as its a direct quote of the post above, please read FAQ for more information.

[Lumie]

@Magga110 don’t suppose you’ve just left a station in north east London on a standby😂😂

[Magga110]

No mate,

south east for me

Edited March 9, 2020 by Keith
Quote of post directly above removed

[Carl]

On 04/03/2020 at 23:19, Rory-495 said:

It's a national test and they haven't tailerord it for LFB so all the BA questions won't make sense.

What is so different in the LFB compared to the national tests. Are the policies and procedures that different from the rest. Just curious of course.

[Rory-495]

The obvious one we found was:

"How much air do you breathe down on a monthly B test? 50 bar, 70 bar, 60 bar, 80 bar?"

While in London policy our monthly B test is measured in duration, ie it's a 15 minute duration test under air.

So we were literally unable to answer the question as it makes no sense to a london firefighter!

[Lumie]

@Carl as you’re an officer I’m guessing you’ll know a lot of these, but we were never taught any of the following in training school or told to learn it as part of the apprenticeship.

1. You enter into a hazard area in BA, what hierarchy of control level is this an example of?
2. What constitutes working in a confined space under the Working at Height Regulations?
3. What Level is silver command?
4. 200 entry pressure, 60 bar safety margin, what is your TAP?
5. Someone has made a complaint that they do not want a room on the station being used as a faith room, what should be done?
6. How long can clay putty be used on an oil drum leak?

 

[Carl]

You are right, I could answer those and a couple do seem to be above those expected of a new trainee, hence the reason I was concerned and asked the question.

In saying that, I doubt nationally, some of those questions would be easy to answer by other trainees as it depends on other criteria. 😟

Thanks for clearing it up though, appreciated

[Keith]

In all seriousness if these tests are so poorly designed, you need to be raising it through your training officers for the Service / Brigade to take back to the awarding body. There are so many variations with equipment and policies across the country for a bog standard national test.

[Lumie]

@Keith yeah my guv has been on the blower to a whole host of contacts. I’ve made my point on the course evaluation too. Union wasn’t really interested, however.

[Rory-495]

We raised it on the day with a SC who was there to check all was going well (it wasnt) and his attitude was "get over it, you'll probably pass so don't worry!"

Needless to say FBU is having a field day over it

[Lumie]

Just got my email saying I passed, funnily enough: no score. Whole course passed according to our group chat. 

Onto the last stage and then hopefully get the book signed off!