Cessation of Trials of EMR and Other Work

[Carl]

Im sure the topic of Cessation of Trials of EMR and Other Work is going to come up at some stage and so thought I would start it off with some forum background information and some ground rules prior to doing so. 

Those who have browsed this forum for many years will know that we kept this as an "Ops and Recruitment Forum" and what started out as the "30K Site" became the place for all the FBU topics. This wasn't to avoid it, it was simply to support the guy who started the "30K Site" and vice versa. 

Moving on, it is impossible to avoid subjects such as this, so please use this topic to discus the current position on the Executive Council statement to end all trials from Monday the 18th September 2017.

All we ask is that all members be courteous with each other and only join in if they have something constructive to add to the debate. If it becomes an issue, we will have no choice but to either delete individual posts or lock the topic. We hope this isn't the case and have always experienced some good membership on here, so hopefully we can keep it that way.  

[Tomit]

Personally think it is shame that the funding couldn't be found to keep the EMR trials going. It's sad to think that someone could be having a heart attack minutes away from a fire station equipped with life support gear and an AED, but have to wait for an ambulance to receive any primary care.

However, unless the pay rise offered to do the work is at least above inflation you can't really argue with the fact that it would be more work for a pay cut.

[Carl]

Totally agree. We attended a great deal, just from my station alone and NWAS were very grateful and I am as proactive as they come. I wouldn't do this site if I wasn't. However, I have now got to the stage where my role has increased massively and with no real pay rise in years, I have even had enough and therefore quite happy its stopped. 

Compared to other countries, UK firefighters are not treated as well, and its no longer the job I once joined. Sadly. 

[BFoster875]

From the outside looking in at the career is co responding and red ones as known in Manchester something that we could see returning in the future or is that a thing of the past, also (just for some background knowledge and not in a bid to start world war three) if I referred to this situation in a interview, next Wednesday at 0830 let’s say, what is the reason for the end of the emr trials as I know to NEVER EVER believe the media ?? As the media puts it , in basic terms - firefighters refuse to carry on with responding to heart attack incidents due to pay dispute ? which I’m not naive enough to believe.  

[Carl]

There are a few issues surrounding the topic. The best way to become versed in what is factual is to see my link in the first post from our union which will give you the history of it all. Read the preceding circulars on the FBU site so that you are fully armed with as much info as you can be, especially if you think it may be a question. 

In terms of coming back, well thats for the FBU and us as members to resolve, but considering we have had no pay rise for what we do prior to the Red One responses, I think that needs to be sorted first.

[Dyson]

^ And to my knowledge, no firefighter has ever refused to help a civilian, in distress, for any reason, including pay.

[Carl]

And I don't think we ever will. 

During the strikes in 2003, a paramedic pulled up on the front of the station picket line asking for help as three kids were dead in a car around the corner and were trapped. This was the first day of the 7 day stint and it was impossible for the crews to say no. A crew got on a pump, cut them out and then left the mess with the Police. A few were very worried on how this would be perceived around GMC and the country. It was accepted that everyone would have done the same. I say everyone, there were a couple that weren't happy. 

However, back on topic, I think something introduced in addition to become part and parcel of our job has to be paid for? Thoughts?

[BFoster875]

Yeah I’ve had a look at that I’m going to have a flick through some of the older material over the weekend, and glad you posted the latter post Carl I was just about to ask the what if an event happens and you are available and local or even at the event already. All these politics  

I can see the theory behind it, for everyday co-responding to be within the job role you would expect a bit of extra pay, its not like it’s a small ask for what you’re doing. I can understand the odd occasion if circumstances are suitable the majority of serving ff’s would do what they could if they saw it happen before their eyes, overall though I can see why there is negotiations that have to take place. Also fuelled by a 13% pay rise for our trusty MPs no longer than 12 months ago if I’m not mistaken for no extra duties other than of course winding up the rest of the British public and in particular the majority of frontline public sector staff at the lower end of the hiarachy. 

[TandA]

Given we are public sector employees, I can't see us getting an above inflation pay award in the near to medium term unless we negotiate it in return for new work or extra responsibilities.  We will often be faced with real terms pay cuts so we just can't go giving away any limited bargaining power we have by taking on the work as a contractual requirement for nothing.  Of course, for the odd incident where we become aware of civilians needing immediate help, then we will all continue to do what we can without thought of extra money, but that is very different to allowing a fullblown contractual obligation for nothing.