Rostering / Working Days Off

[Jet]

Does anyone's brigade here do rostering off pattern? That is to say you are called in to work on your rota days but is then balanced out by getting normal working days off in return?

[Carl]

I wondered how long it would be until this topic would be raised. Ill keep out of it as obviously WMs don't come under the same

[Jet]

Haha you knew it Carl 

Not here to have a gripe or a moan, rather just find out if any other services do it or anything similar...

[HoldFast]

This sounds similar to something Cheshire are supposed to be introducing whereby you forecast your availability for your rota days, and it provides a list of people to be called upon if they are short. I'm not sure if it would be for overtime or instead of one of your shift days. 

[Geeooo]

Yep, Strathclyde's 5 Group Duty System and now the SFRS 5 Watch Duty System have this, PM me if you want buddy.

[SteelCity]

Shropshire have just introduced this system this year. Its an effort to save on the overtime during peak holiday periods. Operational staff, WM included, are asked to roster themselves off for 8 shifts a year (usually 2x tours) then pay them back as 'bank shifts' when required. It's early days for the system so inevitably has some teething problems. We use the Fire Service Rota app to view shortfalls in crewing and are able to book ourselves in via the app. We also have resilience shifts to cover short notice sickness and a short notice recall to duty to cover longer term sickness, both of these are voluntary. 

[Noddy]

I'm sure Iv read that a service can indeed send people home when they should have been working but can't insist that you pay them back? 

[SteelCity]

It's a minefield Noddy so I'll be careful how I put it as the union and management are still ironing things out. You are right in what you say but the official line is 8 days off and 8 days back. As this is it's first year no one knows what happens at the end of the year with all the obvious plus and minus days owed to and from staff. Bank shifts can be paid back to cover shortfalls but also on training days and via resilience shifts (short notice sick cover). It works well for some but doesn't work at all for others. 

[Jet]

So in Shropshire and Cheshires proposed systems, there is a degree of flexibility/choice for firefighters with regard to when they cover on rota days?

[SteelCity]

Yes, total flexibility with rostering back on. 

[MarkG]

Have you got a link to the app, and do you have any business rules/sop/brigade order type description of the system?

We're about to start the same kind of thing in Cornwall and all the help we can get would be great.

[SteelCity]

This is the site / app. I believe it was developed for RDS but Shropshire have had it developed to suit our wholetime.

 https://www.fireservicerota.co.uk/pages/home

We do have a guiding principles document, I'll cut and paste the generic details from it (with permission) and private message it you when I'm back on duty, I'm on leave until 31st July. 

[HoldFast]

I assume that is what we'll be using in Cheshire then or something similar? To my knowledge it will be entirely flexible and completely voluntary in terms of coming back on duty. There's been talk of it being a step towards grey days but who knows. Certainly not me!

[Percy]

Believe me, from working in Workforce Reform for the last three years when I say you are under no legal obligation to come in when rostered off from a set pattern.

We did for a short while but the FBU received an employers (not employees) NJC letter stating the above information.

So we had to switch to plan B which was having 2 sets per one pump watch with no leave allowed. 

[Cardiff_Fire]

Rostering In & Off here. Start on 0. Can be called in to to 4 times and rostered off up to 4 times. Leaving you up to +4 or -4.  Once you are below 0 you can only refuse a shift 3 times before a "chat" with the Station manager....who knows what that entails!

Based on my brigades policy, I'm interested to see the above comment regarding no real legal ability to be rostered in!